well welcome everyone to the religion
unplugged podcast and show where she's
your regular plugin for all of your
religion news and culture with me today
well first I am Joseph Holmes uh
filmmaker film critic podcast host of
the overthinkers and regular culture
critic for religion unplugged and with
me today I have Rachel Alexandra good
friend YouTuber and animator uh anything
else I left out you want some medium
comedian comedian oh wow that's a Jewish
comedian that's so rare I know there's
so many well I always say that because
usually the YouTuber and the animator
Parts don't really communicate that I'm
funny
especially when I'm like going to
conventions and stuff like that people
don't really know what to expect so if I
add that on my title and people are like
oh she's a comedian I get it it's funny
so you know that's not like a it's not
like yeah
otherwise people won't laugh yes yeah if
I if I just draw out sarcasm then people
are like awkward because it's
conventional anxiety so you know it's a
filling thing that helps me work for
myself at the end of the day that
totally makes sense well very glad to
have you on today so uh we are going to
be discussing uh aspects of Judaism and
uh the new movie that partly in
connection with a new movie that's just
came out on Netflix uh you are so not
invited to my bat mitzvah which is an
Adam Sandler movie which is Adam Sandler
and his daughters and his wife
apparently I found out all in the movie
a family affair uh and uh it's uh going
uh gangbusters on Netflix and
um I was uh reviewing the movie and I
realized I don't know uh uh all the
things about Judaism in the modern day
and so I uh reached out to my some of my
Jewish friends was like hey what let's
let's uh what's real here and what what
makes sense uh to uh to uh you know yeah
get that get that part of the experience
and I asked Rachel uh if she'd be
willing to sit down and have a
conversation with me about it as well
for all of your benefit and my benefits
so thank you so much Rachel for uh doing
this
you're welcome I guess it's Street
therapy of the day so
we can always use more of that
that's why I kind of wanted we were
running a lot behind schedule because
Joe uh forgot to tell me this was on
camera so I had to go get ready I'm
gonna put my makeup on and stuff like
that and
um it was stressful because uh the women
will know this this woman and anyone who
identifies as that who uses makeup uh my
I used a um I didn't use my usual um
primer so for makeup you put primer
under your foundation so the blending
helps yes yeah I'm just explaining it to
the audience
and so it was caking really bad on my
face and I had to kind of like it took
me longer than usual um for those
playing at home but you can Google cake
what caking is but I had to like you
know get a hand cloth and wash it off
and reapply and it was it was a lot well
we appreciate it because we get the
benefits of your wonderful face as well
as your wonderful thoughts yeah he's
trying to get my ego to make me feel
better I I can see right through him
unfortunately isn't working no okay all
right yeah when when you when you try to
do that you're very out of character and
so it bothers
but like I'm doing it in a different
voice so clearly I don't I'm not
intending to fool you I'm that's part of
the bit so does that help you're not an
actor my dude it's funny yeah I know but
you just you just your performance
doesn't sell me what can I say okay well
fair enough all right it's a tough crowd
all right so
um first
just um some introductory things this
movie of course is focusing on you know
Adam Sandler and his family his Jewish
family and his daughters as the Stars
particularly one of them uh who's having
their first Bat Mitzvah and uh the drama
that's going on in high school
surrounding that
um but it is of course you know a very
specific well let's start with this
um what is for people who don't know
what is a bat mitzvah how is it
different from a bar mitzvah and what is
involved in that okay so basically
um we talked about a little we talked a
little bit about this about tree movie
and then um to kind of get it out of the
way and then during the movie I was like
oh there's some some slang and stuff so
there was some you know just some
Yiddish mostly um that was in there that
I had to translate for the for the boys
playing at home but um
um it's it's like a coming-of-age thing
so think of like a quinceanera or
um a sweet 16 but for Jewish
um kids and specifically it's more
culturally embedded with a ceremony than
just a party so it's not just the party
there's actual work involved so
um traditionally you will learn
um several
um your the idea is you're leading the
congregation officially because you're a
man or a woman
um so you're
I'm trying to think all the things off
the top my head well if there's a lot
um so the general idea is you're we you
get you are assigned a tour portion
based on the time of your your of your
apartment star or bomb it's
botanicsville let me get to that so bars
mail bot is female Binet is two people
so for bigger conversations for bigger
congregations
um usually they will pair to uh kids up
just because they don't have enough
salaries to accommodate everyone that's
having a um
of
family one family two and they do the
parties separately
um
so I went to a big synagogue when I was
growing up we went to the temple uh TM
it's not actually TM but I always say
that because it's just called the temple
um for those who are interested in film
history it was the film used in uh
Driving Miss Daisy
um with with Morgan Freeman and Driving
Miss Daisy
um and so it's historically famous it's
been around since I think the 1860s and
it was also
um during the Civil Rights Movement it
was the synagogue that was bombed by the
KKK uh no one was hurt but um it was a
very from my understanding it was a very
um
not very successful attempt it was more
of an inconvenience than anything
um but from my understanding
um the this type has always been
um supportive and also like the city has
been supportive of them just trying to
because it's like right it's like a big
deal
um
um because it's it's a it's a famous
synagogue
anyway uh so um you know so it's a big
synagogue it's like the synagogue in
Atlanta so uh quote unquote so that's
where we went and we lived for like 45
minutes so we had to drive in every
Sunday to go to Hebrew school but
um when I say Hebrew school
um it's not it's about the teachings of
based on the unit there was a lot of um
like for the little kids there's some
they learn the basic prayers which was
discussed in the movie
um like the the prayer of the wine and
the bread and
um
the lights the Shabbat lights
um which are usually two singular
candles
um I'm a little rusty on my on my um my
Jewish culture so bear with me why well
I think no worries and then as you get
older
um you you learn about the holidays the
holidays is also a um a you know a young
thing so um so there's Shabbat which is
every
um Saturday it takes place from uh
Friday night when the Sun goes down to
Saturday night and so the um the bar
mitzvahs or the bot ministers usually
take place Saturday morning so usually
they greet the converse the rabbi or the
Canter the Cantor is the singing One the
rabbis like the head one
um we'll we'll greet the congregation
with shabbat shalom so that was also
discussed in the movement so that's what
Shabbat is so that's the most common one
because it happens every week
and then
um for
Orthodox
um Jews Jewish people
um they that's where the like the
the literal taking of the tourist stuff
as far as you know making sure you walk
instead of Drive making sure you don't
use Lights making sure you don't work
um you know that's that's what Shabbat
is that's why you'll see Orthodox people
walking to synagogue Friday night
because they can't drive because that's
that's consumable so yeah so you have uh
Bar Mitzvah or bot mitzvahn so Bar
Mitzvah is the one people have heard
most often if they've heard of it
because that's the um one for for men
which was done much since the 14th
century uh probably around that if I
recall correctly and then it was only
you know later that bot Mitzvah women
got to do that as well and so we're
coming of age okay you're now a man
you're now a woman like you said like
the sweet 16 or others that are done and
a big part of it is
um you know reading from the Torah doing
things going through certain ceremonial
rituals that prove okay you can do the
things that are expected of you as a
part of the Jewish Community which
you're now a part of and so there are
things like that we'll get into maybe
some of what the others are but like is
reading a portion of Torah which is very
interesting based on when you were born
that's very interesting angles it's
called the um the Hof Torah the half
Torah okay right and
um but then also and as part of the
teaching you know you have to go through
um uh you were talking yesterday you
have to go through an extended time of
sort of uh practice and and teaching to
go to go through that and you an
extended particular intense period of
teaching of doing that be just before
you're gonna have your Bat Mitzvah but
the um but throughout uh your growing up
period
um you're gonna have on um Shabbat which
is you know the that uh which is
Saturday like Sunday services for you
know Chris Christians it's like you'll
have like you said it like Sunday school
throughout your growing up years and to
get to uh be taught about the religious
uh religious teachings so from my
understanding Joe you can jump in like
um you know Christians would have this
like service and then Sunday school
after correct sometimes it's before and
sometimes it's after
High School is is it's only school so
usually it's like the woman go off to
lunch you know my mom would always go to
lunch with her her Jewish friends while
we were in synagogue or we were in
Sunday school we learned about
upcoming holidays
um as as you get older it's more um you
know religious
um analytical discussions of Torah
portions or torches
so now you we alluded to this the
different um that there are obviously
just like there are different Christian
denominations and different you know
sects of whatever religion you're a part
of there's different sex of Judaism that
do so what differently you refer to the
Orthodox and you yourself are you were
saying were formed I'm um by culture and
by bringing up I'm
I don't really know where I am right now
spiritually and but like at least I'm
culturally Jewish you're not you're not
alone in that in the yeah
common Trope for Jewish people or
anything it's not just Jewish people I
get like all of the religious Trends in
America are you know are the the nuns
n-o-n-es are growing yeah I don't know
what I am uh so yeah you're you're
you're in a large company
um but uh but but say unless you your
your upbringing was reformed would you
say that the movie was also like uh the
a reformed uh sect of Judaism oh um for
sure we were discussing this during the
movie but we were even like I figured
out like very early on the movie but um
the the setting of the movie had to be a
setting where there were culturally a
lot of Jews already
um Jewish people
um you know a higher population because
you know
um there were a lot of local apartments
or whatever based on the population of
this city so it had to be like so it was
it was probably somewhere in Florida if
I was going to take a guess that makes
sense yeah I guess so just like you know
again like you're you're
um Jews are a minority in America but
there are some but just like all
minorities there's places where it's you
know where guys are oh lots of people
here are targeted together as Jews or
Koreans or something like that so that's
so that so that's uh definitely telling
that's a good point that they are in a
very a large Jewish Community there
um but so what if for the audience how
would you describe what reformed
tradition of Judaism is and uh how it is
different from other Jewish Traditions
so um in contrast to General Christian
theology
different branches of theologies um the
Jewish branches are basically just how
literal you take
um the teachings of the 12 teachings of
you know what those stories tell you so
reform are basically like
we're here we're vibing like they just
kind of like it's about community and
learning that stuff but everyone is kind
of um has their own interpersonal
um
you know struggles with it and that's
just kind of the nature of the Jewish
people like I always you know use the
comparison I think that the Jacob story
is Jacob's fight like literally fighting
with God yeah and they use that all the
we use like that's common to use as a
comparison
um so
um performance is the most laid back one
I would say okay yeah
and then the middle is
um
conservatives yes so you you know I you
know I'm not too from I can't really
speak on that sure that's just the
middle one and then Orthodox is the the
most the most um literal one so you know
they keep kosher it affects how they
dress it affects you know what they like
to say like they literally don't drive
because they have two kitchens in their
house usually so they can eat like you
know there's a big commandment about you
know not eat not boiling a calf and it's
um well there's milk so that affects a
lot of like their home life and making
sure things are Kosher you know that
makes sense and you have um so if you
know generally speaking people would say
okay the Orthodox is more conservative
and the reform is more liberal but
mostly it's that's it's referring to
conservative as being very literal uh in
your interpretation and reformed as
being out we're at a more flexible more
uh yeah yeah okay that makes a lot of
sense
you know it's a spectrum yeah
um so okay that makes sense
um so going broad here you know we had
some of this discussion uh the other day
but in the movie what would you say are
some of the things that stood out to you
uh they referenced
um that resonated or didn't resonate
with your experience and for people who
haven't watched the movie like this this
will be a good thing for you to watch
the movie and watch this discussion
afterwards for some of this you'll pick
up more of that right can I can I can I
start talking about like how I feel
about the movie is that the appropriate
Point
absolutely this is definitely important
um so Joe and I both hated the movie
there were some good things about the
movie they were good there were good
points of representation but
um some jokes landed but not most of
them did most of them didn't
um we the the protagonist was very
unlikable I know it was it was that was
the point of the movie but it just like
to the point of you did we didn't really
want to spend time with this person yeah
um and that could have been something
that was sticks in the editing Bay they
could cut a lot of that down but I think
they just
um they had to keep
wait we think there might be some
nepotism involved in the production of
this movie
I feel safe to say because it's it's
um Adam Sandler's family we we I'm not
sure if Joe kept the products but my
hunch is that that the the daughter of
the star of the movie wrote this script
I didn't she didn't write the Ceramics
no no they got they got you know real
professionals who've written other
things to write it
okay well anyway
um and um she
um this I don't like she's
she's doing the best she can but maybe
she doesn't just doesn't have a lot of
experience with this kind of stuff that
um and this was for a kind of first big
movie and I think if she wasn't a
Sandler then she probably would have got
the part is here to say I mean I think
it's one of those things where like yeah
I mean there's a whole conversation in
Hollywood
about like nepo babies you know it's
like and it's like you know it's not
like you know
look the fact that so many of the stars
are that we have right now that are
related to other stars like you know uh
that is is not a coincidence it's easier
it's any profession to get a job in the
profession that your family has been
that's always been the way it's been and
so you know it's uh some of these you
know like his daughters got you know
first started in working his movies
apparently you know like hubby Halloween
which I didn't watch you know they were
doing it they were doing that and so
yeah obviously yeah there's a there I'm
sure that some of this going around and
you know Adam Sandler has always been a
guy who's been kind of touch and go with
his
um his movies of their quality
um and so it's not a surprise that like
you know a movie that uh that is under
his brand might have the same problems
and you know especially like you know a
lot of it seems like she's trying to do
the same game they're trying to do the
same jokes the way Adam Sandler did like
you know we were talking about the other
day that you know Adam Sandler has a
very particular kind of style of
character that he does that's kind of
unlikable but he kind of makes it work
and so there is a sense of which maybe
she should try to find her own style of
Comedy that isn't just kind of like her
dad's but right I want to make another
comparison before I move on so animation
for those who playing at home is kind of
my um my forte and Adam Sandler did an
animated movie with his production team
called Crazy Nights yeah and
um It suffers from a lot of the same
problems but but an Eight Crazy Nights
it's much more exaggerated like the core
story is beautiful right the animals
defecating everywhere right animated
really
mess up the tone
of the serious the core of the serious
story that they're trying to tell yeah
but so my my guess is Adam Sandler is
like you know be funny if we have all
these natural animals defecating because
it's like a Disney movie except not
really right um and then the animators
were like okay you're paying us and they
do it and he's not he might not
understand how that is messing with the
tone of the serious story that he's
trying to tell so it's much it's kind of
like that in here but I'm on a much
minor level but with the pacing and like
with awkward decisions we're talking
about I mean it's like you know it's
like the movie takes a long time to get
going with lots of slow-mo shots so can
we talk about the slow-mo of the crush
guy yeah
well it's just it's like long slow-mo
shots of like how gorgeous this 13 year
old boy is that she's crushing on and
like you know in a normal movie you
would do like oh here's like one scene
like that that's kind of funny and like
oh okay you get it she's a crush on but
it like happens like five other times
yeah we're not exaggerating like four or
five other times I'm just like okay like
enough guys like yeah roll up three guys
yeah yeah exactly exactly
um so yeah no it's definitely like again
it's it's there's a lot of fun stuff in
there that I like there's some jokes
that really that really work and there's
a sweet kind of story that's at the
heart of it and oddly enough for like
you know the stuff that's you know the
family themselves like Adam Sandler and
his daughters you know have like
interacted with each other is some of
like the best stuff but some other kind
of contrived plotty stuff doesn't really
work which is very much like an Adam
Sandler movie
mm-hmm I think I mean it doesn't like
Adam Zeller can make really good movies
if he wants to or if someone else is
doing the heavy lifting like Hotel
Transylvania is a great oh it is a fun
series but he's not doing the heavy list
he he's not doing the heavy lifting
gently kartikovsky is awesome
he was great acting in iCup gems he did
you know really good early work with
like you know uh Happy Madison and stuff
like that and even I like I don't even
hate the murder mystery
um uh uh uh movies on Netflix they're
just they're fine you know this is um
but uh but yeah no so it's just you know
but it seems like some of the Lesser
good tropes we're kind of uh put into
this movie unfortunately because yeah
there's some there's really good stuff
in there right well because it's I mean
there's kind of like the George Lucas
fives of because he's the one it's his
own Production Studio people are
hesitant to give him direct feedback and
honest feedback because they don't want
to lose their jobs right exactly
becomes very insular
um so in on on on sort of um Jewish
representation level what were some
things that stood out to you about the
movie that um were like oh yeah I
recognize that they got that right or uh
you know uh that maybe not that
um I think our favorite part of it of of
this this crudfest uh I'll say that
because that's what what that's what it
is
um like at the end of the day like you
don't want to watch this movie if a you
don't have any patience or B at least
watch it with friends that can Riff on
it with you yeah because like Jonah Joe
and I both said like if we weren't
watching this for this assignment then
we both would have turned it off just
because happiness is so unlikable yeah
and like some of the things are just
like there's a conversation about like
female
farting essentially
um I don't want to be too crude um on
the professional podcast that is a plot
point in the movie yeah that gets
repeated multiple times this is painful
to watch and I was like I did look up I
said okay was this written by men or
women and it was written by women and
directed by women so it's like okay well
let's confirmed like no one wants to
talk about them I think I said it once
as a joke in high school and everyone
cringed like so then I was like we're
never gonna talk about it again so yeah
like you know maybe the gen's ears are
more open about it but like yeah so
we'll see again it's got like 99 of
rotten tomatoes
so yeah but yeah
okay
um so the our favorite part was
um Sarah Chavez from SNL is the rabbi in
this movie yeah and she had a song that
she improved about God beings
can you give context yeah so this is
okay this is really cool this this can
lead into the next part of our
discussion
um because there is a scene in there
where you know um the the uh Rabbi is uh
is is helping to you know helping this
the students who are getting ready for
their Barn bot Mitzvahs to uh
um to uh you know get ready to get ready
for that and so uh she's doing Jewish
school with them and suddenly all of the
students raise their hands or I don't
know like you know one after the other
and being like hey what about God and
this horrible thing that's happening in
the world you know like climate change
or like you know like disease like and
somebody's like hey what about God and
like gay people and and just all of the
like the hardest questions you know for
or that like every Pastor is like oh man
you know even like a Christian School
girls like oh no oh this is gonna be a
fun one to talk about
and all at once and then the rabbi's
like those are really good questions and
I will answer with a song and she just
goes God Is Random the God Is Random
I'm just on the floor laughing
um as I'm you know because I recognize
that like that whole cringy like
figuring out how to answer those
questions as you know growing up in in
church
um so but yeah so that was something
that like resonated uh with your
experience
um well yeah that that is a good so
great good job so I
I have pretty negative experience
growing up Jewish
um a lot of times
um hence why this movie was kind of hard
for me to watch because the
protagonist is invested on her own to
want to do her Barman Spa but there's
some like
bad takes that are kind of subtexted in
here but that might be relevant to
discuss just in the general Jewish
Community or like you know put it that
way sure um like basically my my I had a
negative experience because I had I was
donated with my brother Josh and I did
have an out to not do it but because it
was with my brother
um I kind of really didn't have it out
because if I chose to to out the bar
mitzvah or the Batman it was the name
it's or whatever right
um so then
where there was a whole you know big
party for for him and everyone's like
all the family friends are like why
isn't Rachel having a Marvin spa or
about him and I'm just like so um fun
fact you know who's on my bar Mr cake
that is interesting as we did discuss
this the other day so we'll there's a
couple of points to bring up with this
right but you is that
um and this is something that's
interesting again for people who are
even not Jewish who are all part of
religious communities and stuff like
that is that one of the things is you
know unlike say you know a modern day
version of like a sweet 16 or something
like that the
um the bar mitzvah Mitzvah situation is
really
about the individual but it is also
really about the community it's and they
bring this up in the movie there's a
scene where Adam Sandler is saying like
you know when you are you know in Temple
you are saying be for God and the
community that I am a part of this and
so there is this idea like look we're a
Jewish community and that is
important for you know for the community
we have a stake in this as a community
it's not just about you it's about us we
have a stake in this and we want you to
learn how to you know do the Torah we
want you to learn how to do all these
things so that you can for us in the
community not just for you and so there
is that tension of it's like well maybe
I don't want to do this it's like well
but you have to do this and that's a
part of this and you know I again as
somebody who's a you know a Christian
who's a part of you know religious
community myself I sort of see both
sides of this on the one hand you know I
don't like everything that my churches
do
um and and I you know and there's things
about it I don't like and there's things
I want to push back on that they do and
your stuff I'm like you know I'm an
individual I want to do things my way on
the other hand you know
we're not just individuals we're also
parts of communities and our communities
have a stake in who we turn out to be
particularly if we want to be a part of
their community and one of the things
Jews have been a lot better at than us
uh Gentiles have for a long time boys
yes yes uh Saturdays are for the boys
um and
um uh have has been being able to have a
robust community that can last over time
even as a minority and it's partly
because they have real are really good
at saying the community matters not just
the individual
um how does how do you interact with
that
um as you know a Jewish person in the
reformed Community sort of not you know
kind of sort of figuring yourself out
now how is your experience of that
attempt to find that balance
um well it's very subjective based on
the individual but I think it's
something that Jewish Community should
have more honest conversation about
because like
I've seen accommodations being
um being given for maybe disabled um
Jewish uh kids who like maybe instead of
reading the tour they're reading kind of
like
um usually in the in the Jewish uh
prayer things they have the Hebrew and
then they have like English
pronunciation of the Hebrews so people
joining can kind of
play along and then they'll have the
translation so they'll have those three
things gotcha so um you know the the I
guess the the advantage of the bar mitz
depart is you can start reading the
Hebrew and following along with the
Hebrew because you draw the Hebrew well
enough to do that
um so that's kind of the incentive
um and it's it's a unifying thing that
you can like they've pitched in the past
if you can go to anywhere in the world
and they're saying the prayers like that
you know sure because it's in Hebrew
um so there's not like a language
barrier thing like if you would go to a
Christian like right yeah a Christian
place in in Spain you know they'd be
doing the prayers in Spanish you know
exactly yeah yeah so there's kind of
like that part of it but the other part
especially once again like you know
there's a lot of biblical Scholars who
I've you know read who are like look you
know understanding them if you if you
actually like take the Bible seriously
being able to understand its original
language is like a huge benefit to like
doing that better yeah it's the same
thing of like learning English because
English is like a very descriptive
language and it's kind of just a
universal like anyway
um so it's just especially as we get uh
more of like the LG uh btqia
um marinardi gets vocal about this stuff
where especially the trans Community
because bar and Bot and Benet it's all
gender specific like that's a lot of
um pressure to put on a 13 year old
especially if someone of that age maybe
might not be comfortable with their
gender as an example so I think we need
to have like to the to the Jewish people
listening I think we need to have more
honest conversations just give the bar
mitzer process as far as in the general
bargain process is
right for the individual because you
know it might not be or there might need
to be a combinations like mine was
incredibly stressful and hard and I
didn't have the privilege or the enough
privilege even they they
um
the convenience of learning the prayers
via a song so usually what the process
is the cancer the singer will record all
the prayers for you directly so you can
practice at home so it's like an MP3
track that you've decided over again
um I didn't have that privilege so I had
to read the actually read the the the
Torah yes like
yeah I did I did hard mode because yeah
that's a good way to put it yeah God
said directly suffer Rachel
so you had
so like if I if you can correct me if
I'm wrong it's like the part of the
Jewish tradition is to make reasonable
accommodations to individuals and so and
and like we'll get even the process of
becoming reforms it should be I'm not
sure if that's something that's I don't
really keep up with this kind of thing
so I'm I'm sure there are conversations
happening about this kind of stuff but I
think we need to be more open about
having them sure okay yeah the fair
enough well if the partnership is having
figure out again even like just to like
even if you're Orthodox like the idea
that okay is having a car driving or not
like having those you know is like
that's a thing that a conversation
didn't happen until cars were invented
right right and so as certain things
happen uh you could figuring out
different ways to accommodate
individuals so like that that is a
conversation at least to your point that
should be being had okay I wanted to say
like to kind of generalize this because
I have a point to generalize this
um so the big like one of the big Jewish
beliefs is is is saving life and life is
precious and that kind of rises above
all belief you know so that was a big
thing
um I just watched
um not just watch like when it came out
um the Anne Frank um story from meeps
perspective Meep was her caretaker
called a small light on Disney plus yeah
and that was a big
and so
um so that's just kind of like the
general caveat so you know I think at
the end of the day if we want the youth
to be involved in the bar Mr process
thought minister of process Binet
whatever you're you're your pronouns are
um there needs to be more honest
conversation about you know
a if it's right for the individual and B
if they want to do it out of their own
volition they're not being pressured by
their parents so rabbis go take the
children aside and be like hey are you
doing this is it your party or is it
your parents party that's important
question
um
and just say okay well like there might
be the other thing too is there might be
um disability sure concerns I'm sure the
Orthodox Community has more experience
than this but like even now that um I
work with a lot of autistic
um people in my work because it's a lot
of animators and that correlates and
there might be
extra hard things
um that maybe the parents are aware of
for major autistic reasons and so kind
of making them go through trial by fire
um you know even if they get to sing it
you know the whole process can still be
challenging sure what are there so is
there a line because you were talking
about
legitimately you know hey there needs to
be accommodations made to the individual
you know is there a line where you would
see it might go too far in that way
where it's like hey an individual wants
this but it's not best for the community
is there is there a situation you can
imagine
I have a direct example of that oh okay
great so my direct example is I won't
name names but um I went to apartment
stuff
Sonic Cruise where
um the the child's parents paid for the
rabbi and his wife to go on the cruise
so he could have his bar mitzvah and he
read the bar mitzvah
um he did his bar mitzvah the reading
translated to Hebrew on a piece of paper
over the Torah
um
you know with I don't think he did any
prep work for it gotcha thank you if
there was prep work it wasn't a lot so
that's when it stops becoming about
the process and it becomes an excuse to
go on a cruise with a rabbi
um okay yeah that's a great example yeah
so I think um for those for those
educators are playing at home I think is
important to include maybe
um counselors from school or teachers in
the process of this if they feel
comfortable reaching out just to make
sure just to get a read on the trial to
make sure they have the full picture
before you know approaching those kind
of competitions it's my recommendation
sounds great okay so now getting into
the more
um explicitly like religious aspects of
Judaism that were brought up in the
movie
um so we talk about that God Is Random
bit
um as being one part that we both really
enjoyed
um like the only part but continue
um
I I enjoyed other parts of it but it's
definitely one-on-one stood out most
um was the
um is talking about how you know Judaism
deals with certain theological questions
versus often many Christian communities
um because yeah well I was surprised how
much like explicit talk about God there
was in this movie because usually again
you know when I watch movies sort of
like about Jewish culture and Jewish you
know experiences those are kind of left
Society except for like one joke here
and there like you know Woody rally
movies and stuff like that and so what
is interesting so I mean she like you
were saying you know she does a are you
there God it's me Margaret thing of like
you know praying and talking to God and
stories but in the but then specifically
you know the scene we're talking about
you know they bring up the issue of like
okay how do you reconcile a good God
that's supposed to be worthy of our
worship
um with the suffering that you see in
the world and so like growing up in the
reformed communities how was that the
question addressed right I mean the the
movie presented let me just say for the
record the movie presents it pretty fair
and pretty accurately it started to
perform so um but you know I think the I
like in the scene like I'll just I'll
just start talking about this stuff
because I can of course in the scene
that you that we talked we just talked
about about the God Is Random I always
heard I think I said this like they're
gonna do like some kind of Holocaust
save the Holocaust be for when Adam
Sandler is yelling at his daughter to
make sure she does the bar mitzvah and
that is
um the highest form of Jewish guilt is
bringing up the Holocaust so let me tell
you
um there's a great song from Crazy
Ex-Girlfriend where um it's they're
doing apartment it's it's in a bar
mitzvah and like it's a song but during
the bar mitzvah they they're like I
don't want to bring the I don't want to
bring up the Holocaust but like remember
the Holocaust remember how much it
suffered the song is called uh remember
that we suffered so you know in a bar
mitzvah it's like so it's a great day
but remember that we suffered wow
that was handled much better but
um you know like
um so I know that we suffered I I I I I
did my own personal suffering yeah for
this religion but I think
we need to stop like I think Jewish
people maybe like that's what I meant by
the individual stuff it's like trying to
not make it so much of a statement for
the non-goys and make it do it for
ourselves and our family and our
community and if it's not right for the
individual for whatever reason then not
to make not to Guilt Trip them into
doing the Mormon stuff sure no fair
enough so like that's so that you're but
you're so you're right like they didn't
bring up the Holocaust there but in a
discussion about God and suffering you
know you were talking about the fact
that before the Holocaust becomes front
and center with exactly because we like
we Joe and I talk about we're friends in
real life so we talk about this all the
time so I use the Holocaust as kind of
like a you know we don't have Jesus as
our personal buddies we just have Jesus
as kind of like another preacher in our
many line of preachers right um like Joe
even asked if Jewish people have saints
and I'm like no we got the um got God
and we got the
yeah and we got the profits that's about
it yeah yeah and we got some some famous
rabbis who have some good and bad takes
that's about right yeah
um so you know like you know so our and
you know we have Old Testament God we
have the one we have the the one who
punished us for
um making the golden calf so we always
joke that God went through if if Jesus
was really God's son then he probably
went through some character development
along the way
um so you know but then like but we we
we kind of take it in strides but just
like the Holocaust is so viscerally like
that it's hard to be like oh we're doing
okay you know I always think about
Family Guy scene of just like the the
Jewish uh people building the pyramids
which wasn't that didn't happen right
but for the sake of the joke they they
were doing that and just like our
austrians are getting our
our
suffering other way early we got it from
here you know
what was it um
uh Jon Stewart once did he feel like
he's like this is every Jewish holiday
um they tried to kill us but they didn't
get all of us let's eat
um yep that's correct eating is like a
huge part of Jewish culture I love Jon
Stewart you know come on my podcast John
Stewart please we can talk about Jewish
things in our shared trauma anyway yeah
um uh but anyway so that but so yeah so
the Holocaust we talked about this
camera before but is you know it is that
question of like okay well how could God
a God be good it is the ultimate
expression of how could God be good and
allow all this suffering and
particularly suffering for towards
people that he says you know is his
chosen people yeah recent memory is the
big the big thing and so how
the house or like reconciled or that
that you've seen like he's like how do
they have that answer of is it like just
literally what they do in this like God
Is Random we don't know or oh yeah I got
this well I can speak from um my my
experience growing up and then I can
speak to my personal career experience
so I'll do the first one
um I'll do the the growing up fruit so
growing up um just like I have a German
um team member on my production team and
we talk about this pretty openly but
like I always have to pre-fest like you
know don't don't just tell people on the
internet without any context that you're
working for the Jewish lady for free on
the internet
as a German you know just you know
um but we get Holocaust Education
drilled into us unfortunately like I
think every like they have Holocaust
Remembrance Day and the temple was due
some kind of project usually for
Holocaust Remembrance Day and
um I've been to the Holocaust Museum in
um Washington DC
um I feel like I've been to another one
um but I've done a lot of my own
educational stuff about like everyone
like in their mom's heard of Anne Frank
you know um
and it's just like
it can be it's it's draining you know
it's a lot like to hear about that every
year and they have to do a personal
project like I've had to like I've had
personal projects where I've had to
write a story from a real life child's
point of view about dying in the
Holocaust as a um as a like a 10 or 11
year old that's pretty heavy yeah
um you know and like there's like choose
your adventure Holocaust Edition books
out there really
from my memory I could be wrong but I
remember like getting assigned like
that's how the story is I'm just like
um you know like to kind of emphasize
how close like people might not have
made it so written by Jewish people sure
probably said
um but you know it just like I'm kind of
but me personally at the point I'm kind
of like
I get it like I get it like I'm not
gonna forget
I got this so um I think Spielberg has
the best policy about like making sure
that people tell
their stories and to Archive them and
just cause awareness but like Spielberg
got to do Schindler's lists and then
kind of put a pin in it yeah and
emotionally and but you know sometimes
the general Jewish population doesn't
get that artistic kind of like okay
um so but the other the other criticism
will happen before we move on about this
is like I know everyone hurt I know
everyone's heard of Anne Frank I thought
my phone was off but anyway I thought I
thought everyone's everyone's heard of
Anne Frank we've all heard it we've seen
we've seen the story there's an anime of
Anne Frank there's a live action Anne
Frank there's an animation French
animation event like it's just like you
get it
um so I think in general we have to
start talking about more stories that
aren't just Anne Frank
um I think Anne Frank is kind of a
little bit oversaturated at this
particular point in history not that we
shouldn't tell her story but there's
she's one of many yeah we've done her
we've done her and there are others we
can also do yeah yeah so that makes
sense so it's one of the things it's
like in in
and the Christians deal with the whole
you know if God good and powerful why
why all of this gestures and everything
gestures everything
um and the typical answer and I don't
think it's a terrible answer like I
think I I find it like not completely
satisfying but I do find it um answers
you know generally my uh my my angst and
questions about it you know is twofold
one is
that God created people to love and be
loved by and love has to involve some
kind of free agency free will because if
not you know again it's
love its coerced is not love love that
is you know is is you can't you don't
have any free choice but to love it's
not love and so he has to some degree
give human beings Free Will and so
um we do evil in the world and uh and we
do evil and and that starts out started
out with the first humans however you
want to conjecture
um uh that um what you call it the
Avenue story whether that's history
Mythos or mytho history as uh uh when
Craig likes to put it
um
but um it's again it started out with
the first humans and of course this
process also did damage to the Natural
World which is even in Jewish Scholars
I've read you know take that as like
yeah I think there's you know the
violence done against humans as violence
the natural world
yeah well also like and envy even the 8K
enable story is like you know it did
harm to the Earth and like in those
States the violence did harm to the
Earth which talks about is sort of
explanation Supernatural disasters
however you want to talk about that and
so I find that that's the typical
Christian answer that's given and I find
that answer pretty satisfying not an
emotional level but on an intellectual
level yeah um and so
um is there is that a a common sort of
explanation that is given sort of in
reformed uh
Jewish tradition or is or does that not
kind of
um does nobody really find that very
compelling
um in my personal experience the second
one so
um it's just kind of like
yeah when you when you pitch those kind
of things that make sense but that's
like you know the Holocaust is in such
recent memory and such directly targeted
towards the Jewish people that they're
just like
yeah I've heard that one time so that's
kind of like yeah so it's kind of like
okay you can say that but like it's like
it's you know but like God you you
really you know let us get yeah we have
we've had a holocaust speaker speak to
us before a temple yeah and I remember
like just as a contrast of how you know
people might be removed is I was very
quiet until like my my senior of high
school so I never said I never said
anything I was paying attention I love
stories so I'm sure that was keeping my
attention but like two of the other
girls were
um playing like switching shoes and
playing around and like the congregation
was pissed and like they were yelling
and just like you know
yelling at them like and yelling at us
as a class and I was just like I was I
paid attention but like you know like
uh no I get that yeah like come on guys
like don't like yeah people can beat you
uptight about that sort of thing yeah no
it's not no I'm I'm I'm to be clear of
casting shade at the other girls
messing around while they they they got
a holocaust Survivor to talk about his
personal story in person like that's
right no that's fine you have to be
upset about that
um so the
um who is it oh maybe uh think of
another piece of this oh yeah so
when so it's interesting to me another
aspect of this that to me is interesting
is
the um the interplay between you know um
Jewish people being a culture as well as
religion you know and and they talk
about this again you kind of they deal
with this in the movie they don't you
know do a dissertation on it but you can
see this as an interplay that happens
um that you know uh they do and it's
funny it's like they do talk about God
sort of as if he's real in the movie and
one of the things that's interesting is
um you know I I've always found it
interesting that you know they're
Christians you know I'm in Christian
communities and they're Christians who
you know sometimes you know will go to
church but they'll be kind of like it'll
call us as Christians but like
we don't really believe that there's a
God we don't really believe that any of
this happened we don't really believe
but the result of that is typically the
denominations that have that attitude
that is kind of like ah this is good for
Community
um but it's uh but we don't really
believe it those tend to die fairly
quickly they have the most kind of um
uh they they bleed the most members uh
the fastest you find like the
progressive and the mainline
denominations of Christianity they tend
to they they basically they're almost
like non-existent they've been losing
members over the decades really fast it
tends to be the denominations where they
actually believe that you know Jesus
Christ did rise bodily from the dead and
there was a virgin birth and you know
and so that is like okay like these ones
and that makes sense to me because it's
like okay if you're gonna like believe
this maybe you should actually believe
it otherwise what's the point and one of
the things that's fascinating to me
about the Jewish Community is it less
that way it's not entirely not that way
but it is less that way you do find a
lot even more so than in
um Christian communities you find a lot
of people who are going to be culturally
Jewish you know without actually you
know uh believing that there's a God or
that you kind of really want to have a
relationship with him
um you know if and uh and it just it
seems odd to me it's like okay why would
you spend all this time memorizing the
Torah reading you know if if you don't
like believe it's actually true even in
a like okay like some of these stories
are metaphors but God's actually real
and he wants us to learn this stuff it's
like if God didn't actually come down to
the prophets and say hey you guys got to
learn this stuff what would be the point
of being Jewish in a meaningful sense
and that but again that's my sort of you
know [\h__\h] uh perspective on it
um what what how how
do you see other people within your
tradition interacting with that because
you said like
performance a little bit more on the
spectrum of more likely to say maybe
maybe not how do you see other people
interacting with that in your
communities and how do you interact with
that personally okay well um as many
um Jewish comedians can protest to
um it's much more open it's not like a
close secret that you know the like you
know people that are Jewish kind of
fight with it like the rabbis fight with
it like it's like it is a accepted part
of the the the the the five stages of
grief essentially
um so
[Music]
you know the rabbis are just a happy
that people are showing up and B making
it more about like well this is this is
the Torah this is the Taurus thing this
is the Torah portion for the week
because there you read it over the
Jewish calendar essentially and you have
different that's how the holidays right
and the Jewish calendars lunar based
versus you know you know so like that's
why Hanukkah is always on a different
like
like fun fact
um but you know so that's so it's more
just about people showing up and you
know vibing and then especially with the
changing of the world Jewish people are
just known to be more open because they
ask those intellectual questions so um
and then you know so if there's other
people in need that aren't Jewish like
the temple has a um a nice little um
what is it um a homeless shelter on site
that they they run and they use
donations to run so that's good
um you know like that's kind of the
point
um and
it did but you know they they drug test
people and stuff yeah
um I don't know like but um
I think it's also just to tell them tell
the Nazis to suck it like especially
with a lot of that um
the political climate can be tricky
sometimes
um especially in the last five or six or
four years yeah yeah I can see it
actually so you know the fact that that
we're still going despite everything is
kind of a statement in itself and that's
what people kind of get invested in you
know okay like a fun uh cutaway that I
always tell people is that um Christmas
and it used to be as sexual sexual
secular
um it was and then Rudolph the Red-Nosed
Reindeer was invented by a Jewish person
to help with that and I love Rudolph I'm
the biggest Rudolph simp I love breaking
mask and I it was frustrating to not be
able to celebrate that
um growing up because you know I didn't
grow up as big of a Jewish Community as
this protagonist did and to kind of have
to pick both pick one or the other
absolutely I mean you know I mean this I
mean like you know white Christmas you
know almost all the great songs the the
you know one of the great stories of
sort of like Christmas you know like
Charles Dickens kind of invented our
modern version of Christmas and then you
know in American culture because you
know most the entertainers were Jewish
and they were kind of fair hey there's a
version of Christmas that can be for
everyone right um yeah
and that's kind of and that's more of a
staple in like
um and and Manhattan and New York in
general because there's just a higher
Jewish population in general so people
are just naturally more
um
tolerant accepting because they're
actually having to interact with Jewish
people and not just hear them about hear
about them like their unicorns you know
yeah absolutely yes like like when you
like when you went to Atlanta yeah yeah
um okay yeah no okay so yeah so there is
that's interesting I guess that one
interesting things about it is that the
Jewish identity is both you know
cultural and it is you know to some
degree ethnic but it's cultural and it's
religious and the religion is so tied to
the cultural right you know to to hold
on to the cultural you sort of do have
to hold on to the religious rituals at
least
um and so that is kind of keeping the
religious rituals as a part of the
culture as you're holding on to the
culture right yeah it's it's kind of
like a snake eating its tail thing
um is what I would like even there's an
episode of house that I can't remember
the name of the episode which one house
is dating the female doctor who's also
Jewish okay and has to go to the dinner
and
um the the dog I don't know I don't
watch house I'm just using doctor lady
so Dr lady is like come to my Jewish
dinner and house is like I'm not Jewish
and then I think the mom is like neither
is like neither is anyone here you know
yeah
yeah no that I can see okay very cool
now that's that makes a little that
makes a lot of sense
um okay any other
um
uh any other uh things that you would
like people to know if they've watched
the movie or if uh and um uh or if
they've not watched the movie that you
can we haven't brought up that you would
like to let people know before we sign
off
I'm interesting I'm thinking as I
scratch my eye um
it's just not a good movie it's just
like it's what are better movies that
represents
um Jewish life and culture that people
should watch and stuff that's the whole
that's the whole point of Adam Sandler's
career there's not a lot
you know
as an animator it makes my my my heart
hurt if I can someone there's a very
possible Christmas yes
okay
um I wish there was a Kim Possible
Hanukkah episode it would save me so
much trouble
um I have I have some good ones um so
Rugrats does some great
um Jewish stories because Tommy is half
Jewish on his mother's side so they do a
good pass up over episode and a good
Hanukkah episode okay so with fun little
subplots you know about that
um uh we were talking about this
yesterday but um The Ghost and Molly
McGee and moon girl and devil dinosaur
also have Bar Mitzvah themed episodes
check those out like on YouTube just
those names and you know Bar Mitzvah
something that yeah they're Batman
supposed they're both female characters
that helps if that helps with your
search engine terms but um
um you know those were much better
stories frankly because they had they
were about like the whole beat of this
movie is about friendship conflict but
like it's just like like this there's a
scene where one of the what the main
characters is indirectly embarrassing
the her friend at the bar mitzvah or her
Batman's buttons incredibly painful and
I made a comparison that this is like
Carrie but not as fun because it's just
like you know it's coming but it's just
like you know you don't have any payoff
at the end it's just like cringe
um so yeah all right yeah so do check
those out
um Phil thank you so much for joining me
to educate uh myself and everyone else
who is watching slash listening uh to
this and thank you for uh dolling
yourself up for the uh for the the video
portion of this person my friend I would
have been like I'm doing this later
no I very much appreciate it
um if people want to uh find you and
follow your content where can they go
um so I'm I love Kim Possible on the
internet
um my that's her name and she also loves
Kim Possible but yes yeah that's my
that's my stage name we'll say that's
why on my if you if you're listening or
you're watching the me on camera that's
why my little slash is KP because that's
a short version of my username
um so it's I love spelled l-o-v-e can
possible a lot
um you know we haven't made um we
haven't put out some main Channel
content in the hot second because of uh
wife things I can't really help but
there's some there's some stuff coming
trust me we work very hard
um on I'm most active on Twitter um I
love KP a lot on Twitter I have a fan
server that you can find on my LinkedIn
on Twitter as well as my business email
like I'm pretty open for this kind of
stuff
um assuming you're actually a business
and not just like some random person
um you know um I have my own podcast
cast called animation communication with
a K it's on YouTube it's on all the
streaming platforms
um and that's generally it um Discord
the Discord server is the best probably
the best place if you're interested in
like meeting some cartoon friends or you
know wanting to use that as Community if
you're kind of um a little isolated so
yeah yeah
that'd be fun
I still have uh I still she's still
trying to drag me into Discord and I am
still old Manning at trying to figure
out how to use that well
um so but yeah if you're a young if
you're a youngster uh you're a Zoomer
and you're you're or gen Alpha and
you're yeah
because Tick Tock owns everything you
put on there and that makes me that's
kind of suss yeah that's fair all right
well
thank you so much for joining us um and
of course if you want to uh follow me
and I'll I'm on all the socials as well
usually with some normal guy uh in there
because that's all this brand that that
when I when I started these social media
platforms that's what I was calling
myself and then uh I'm also I like I
said culture critic for religion
unplugged you can also find me on my
podcast the overthinkers on uh wherever
you find podcasts and the
overthinkersjournal.com and uh yeah
search my name uh elsewhere you'll find
some other places I've written stuff
um but yes thank you so much uh Rachel
for joining and thank you all for
joining us we have you want to tell them
about the no way home video
um is that up
we're working on a collab video about uh
Spider-Man no way home and the way
that's um you know uh opened up and
changed how that changed uh um how uh
superhero movies are made in ways that
people don't quite appreciate and uh
fans
um fan uh and fan and uh Creator
relations and such yeah so I don't have
a deadline for that but maybe like in
the next two or three months so cool
yeah no so we're excited we put some a
lot of work into that Rachel put a lot
of work into that we're very excited
long long script but it should turn out
really well hopefully yes yes
um all right anyway yes so thank you so
much for joining us and as always this
is religion unplugged cop podcast for
your regular religion and um news and
culture plugin